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Plasma Messick's avatar

If the question is “what is a real number?”, then Dedekind cuts or Cauchy sequences are relevant, but still not quite the answer. Those are methods of “constructing” the reals.

The real numbers are best defined axiomatically — as an ordered field with the least-upper-bound property — with the aforementioned construction methods being treated as existence proofs. The real numbers are a self-consistent mathematical pattern with a particular bundle of properties that relate to other things we care about in especially useful ways.

Side note: the reason we can speak of “the” real numbers is that any two models of those axioms are canonically isomorphic. This fact and its proof should also be regarded as part of the existence proof, just as important as showing that Dedekind cuts (or whatever) satisfy all the necessary algebraic properties and so on.

Sometimes mathematicians will say things like “we define the real numbers to be sets of rational numbers such that...”. This is especially likely in a formal text. However, this is a lie. If you take it at face value you will end up believing things which are mathematically meaningless by convention, such as “the rational number 2 is a member of the real number π”, which is utter nonsense.

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Sarah Constantin's avatar

ok this is tragic!

i learned about Dedekind cuts (and Cauchy sequences, I think?) in a math summer camp in high school. it took weeks to get there and was presented as a grand finale, and of course we got hyped up for it.

tbh i don’t know what i’d have done without math camp. high school classes don’t have proofs apart from geometry, college classes don’t spend enough time & attention teaching you how to prove (and there’s too much time & grade pressure getting in the way) so unless you’re smart & motivated enough to be totally self-taught (I wasn’t) or have unusual early educational opportunities like me, you’re just screwed! you will not learn (higher) math! mathematics departments do not prioritize teaching you!

nobody cares because few people learn higher math at all, and those who do are strongly pressured to identify student confusion with student stupidity/laziness rather than bad pedagogy.

if we talk about the problem at all it’s in a ~woke way that too often conflates making math accessible with watering it down.

There’s no constituency for teaching a given curriculum more effectively -- ie if you’re teaching arithmetic, ensuring most students learn arithmetic; if you’re teaching calculus, ensuring most students learn calculus; if you’re teaching a first proof-based class, ensuring most students learn to write proofs.

My sister teaches college math and she is basically alone on team “AcTuAlLy TeAcH sKiLls” as opposed to “sift for geniuses who don’t need teaching” or “make the class pathetically easy so nobody gets bad grades”.

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